Truman and LOZ length limit changes? Spider rigging new regulations?

Still hearing a buzz about a 10" length limit for Truman and maybe LOZ and possible creel limit change as well. Also heard a comment from a couple guys that there may be some changes to the regulations on spider rigging/trolling. I'm guessing that would have to reducing the number of rods we can use per person. Any info or timeframes for any of the above would be great. I've been rigging Truman for as long as anyone I can remember. I use to push it pretty hard to get people in to it. My defense was always that a limit was a limit. But now I have some worries after seeing 25 boats in each creek up and down the Grand arm all winter the last couple years. The guys that have switched to rigging are now able to catch fish that they normally would not have been able to catch fishing with one or two poles. So even though my original stance of a limit is a limit I am worried after seein so many fish come out of major creeks in Nov.-March that never would have been fished for or caught in years past.

I personally like the idea of upping the length to 10" to get a little more size. As far as spider rigging and more fish being caught I know MDC does keep track of the population by shocking fish every year and from my understanding the crappie population in Truman is good. The nice thing about crappie are they are prolific spawners and it's not hard to get the population up if it does go down if you have a good spawn. Definitely something to keep an eye on.

I am all for raising the length limit to 10" also. I don't eat fish so I rarely clean fish but from my experience there is not much to a 9" fish even compared to a 10"-10 1/2" fish. If I am keeping fish I try to keep 11"-12" fish. If it slows when trying to get that last couple for a limit I will keep some in the 10 1/2" range. I was just curious to the rigging rumor because I like to rig myself and certain times of the year during tournaments you better be doing it. I would not be against making it a 3 rod per person. If fishing with a partner that still gives a good spread of 6 rods. Would be a change for when I am by myself going from 8 to 3.

Back in my Arkansas Oxbow days we always had three hooks/pole. Nine baits is still good coverage.

Some of my post disappeared. I was saying in the days of Oxbow fishing you fished 6-8 rods with 3-4 hooks per. I generally went with three, hook-jig-hook, jig-hook-jig, or jig-jig-jig, never hook-hook-hook. I'd spread em 18-24" apart so I'm covering some good range of the water. Too much cover on Truman to do that many for the most part, but wait another 20 years and it'll be clearer.

Would love a 10" length limit on both lakes. Don't rig so cant say much about that.

Preface by saying am a fan of MDC, think they do a good job given the challenges. Crappie are classified as a pan fish, pure and simple. Many of us see them as a sport fish and prefer catch and release for the most part. But MDC, seems to me, manages crappie fisheries primarily for the purpose of consumption rather than the purpose of a trophy fishery. Personally wish it wasn't that way, to me a fish is way too valuable to only use once and the thought of someone catching a fish later that I released is rewarding. But it seems it takes some significant population or catch rate change to prompt updated guidelines and laws on panfish. Given the number of crappie anglers in the state it my belief that MDC budgets a disproportionatly smaller amount of funds for crappie management than they do for some of the more glamorous species like walleye, spoonbill, trout, and bass. It usually takes a bad wreck or two to get a stoplight installed at a dangerous intersection, may take a population crash at Truman to let people know that "the well will never run dry" isn't necessarily correct. A subpar spawn and recruitment year or two such years in a row on Truman could be a real eye opener.

Really a good thread and, as always Kaz, articulated very well.

We have to remember how well the MDC as done here in Mo. not only in fishing but hunting as well. There are states where you can only fish with one rod no matter what you are fishing for. I to would like to see a larger length limit but, no matter what they (MDC) do there will allways be someone who complains. I myself do this I don't always keep the smaller fish or bigger fish and not always a limit so I can say to myself, self you left some and I let everyone else make up there own minds on how they fish and what they keep as long as it is on the legal up and up

Any talk of changes at Truman or LOZ are very premature at this point. Quite frankly we don't have the pressure, catch and harvest information we need to determine if spider rigging is having an adverse affect. The biologist is analyzing age and growth information from this past fall to get the latest information on crappie growth. There is a creel survey proposed for 2018 (I think) to get at the pressure, catch and harvest information. What I've found is that our crappie anglers have become much more educated over the years. When 10"+ fish are available, few 9" fish are kept. So I question whether an increased length limit would have much impact. But like I said any proposed regulation changes talk is premature, but rest assured our guys are collecting population information and keeping tabs on everything. Truman is a crappie factory and sometimes you just have to say "It ain't broke, let's not fix it".

MOfishmgr thanks for your reply to this. This forum is great to get questions answered truthfully by the ones that really know. So thanks again.
We are truely lucky to have such a great fishery as Truman right in our backyard. I only crappie fish now but the catfishing and walleye have been unreal the last couple years for the guys and gals that like to chase after them. Looks like the bass are on their way back this last fall and this spring. Had a friend catch over 22 lbs and had a 8 1/2 lb kicker in a tournament last weekend. I have traveled all over the place chasing crappie on the tournament trail and fun fishing. I have yet to find a place I would trade for Truman and I have been to what some call the best in the country. Grenada, Lake Washington, Kentucky lake. I may change my mind when I get back from Lake Fork in April.

Good luck at Lake Fork. I actually interviewed for the job of managing that lake 15 years ago. It wasn't a good fit with existing staff so I took myself out of the running but managing it would've been fun.

Truman isn't my lake but I was helping the biologist last fall with age and growth sampling and we got to talk about the crappie population quite a bit. MDC can be very conservative when it comes to regulation changes. There must be ample evidence that a regulation change is needed and that it will make a difference. Our procedures require us to convince a regulations committee of other biologists that our science is sound, we've considered all options and that we can predict expected outcomes. Then the Director and the Commission must approve the change. And this doesn't include public meetings where input from the public is gathered. This is much more rigorous than other states who have to go through the legislature to get regulations changed.

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Originally Posted by Jigging15

Still hearing a buzz about a 10" length limit for Truman and maybe LOZ and possible creel limit change as well. Also heard a comment from a couple guys that there may be some changes to the regulations on spider rigging/trolling. I'm guessing that would have to reducing the number of rods we can use per person. Any info or timeframes for any of the above would be great. I've been rigging Truman for as long as anyone I can remember. I use to push it pretty hard to get people in to it. My defense was always that a limit was a limit. But now I have some worries after seeing 25 boats in each creek up and down the Grand arm all winter the last couple years. The guys that have switched to rigging are now able to catch fish that they normally would not have been able to catch fishing with one or two poles. So even though my original stance of a limit is a limit I am worried after seein so many fish come out of major creeks in Nov.-March that never would have been fished for or caught in years past.

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I fish a lot of the places that you fish on Truman, up river from Bucksaw, and have for 20 years. There has been a real change in the fish population and the fishing pressure over that time. The winter fishing, guides, and the spider rigging (as well as the news about it on the internet) have changed the lake.

I'm a single poler and the fish aren't nearly as abundant as they used to be, and that is due mainly to the fishing pressure. The crowds on that section of the lake have gone up dramatically, as in 4-5+ times the number of fisherman.

There are fewer fish than there used to be, but you are right, the fish finders, and fishing techniques have really changed things. Even 15 years ago there were winter holes being fished with 8+ boats on top of them everyday, back before spider rigging, where I thought the pressure was too much to be sustainable in the long term.

I'd even be OK with a 11" limit on that arm of the lake, or stretch of water.

I also think the protection on blue cats on Truman was unnecessary, but the pressure on flatheads in the spring is also detrimental. I fully support more protections length/creel limits for the flatheads.

Different length limits on different arms probably will never happen. Agents would have a hard time enforcing it and less experienced anglers would have a hard time following it. With boats capable of 70 mph, anglers can fish several arms a day. Crappie populations can decline in popular areas of a lake while the overall population remains in good shape. I wasn't involved in the blue cat regs, but the idea is to harvest more of the fish under the slot. The biologist is expecting the remaining fish to grow better. It's a very similar idea to a bass slot-limit with the added benefit of allowing 2 fish over the slot. Flatheads are a different story. I have no knowledge of the flathead fishery there except I've caught a few jugging. However in Smithville Lake the flatheads get hit pretty hard, sometimes by me!, and they've been holding up well. Fishery science can be tough. It's not like I can drive by the lake and see what's in there. It takes a lot of effort to sample enough fish to accurately evaluate a population. It takes measuring 400-600 bass a year to have a statistically valid sample. The longer the fish the more you need to collect too. Rest assured the folks charged with managing the fish populations are just as avid a fisherman as most anglers. We care a lot about our fisheries. I especially do since I'll be retiring in a year or two and then I'm gonna get to fish more! Best of luck, spring is on the way! And be careful out there please. High winds this time of year coupled with cold water can spell disaster.

What is amazing about this conversation is that everybody seems to think that anybody that fishes catches a limit every time out. The real truth is that on any given day 1% of the anglers will catch their limits, but 99% won't. In actual fact, (if it were studied) it would show that 90% of the people that have fished any particular lake have NEVER caught a limit.

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Originally Posted by Hank,J

What is amazing about this conversation is that everybody seems to think that anybody that fishes catches a limit every time out. The real truth is that on any given day 1% of the anglers will catch their limits, but 99% won't. In actual fact, (if it were studied) it would show that 90% of the people that have fished any particular lake have NEVER caught a limit.

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When we do creel surveys, one of the things we are looking to get is exactly this information. The "stringer tables" show us what the typical angler harvests per trip. The stringer tables tell us how many anglers limit out and also how high a length limit or how low a daily limit would have to be to reduce harvest. Many times the stringer tables will show that we don't have a problem of overharvest. The old adage that 20% of the anglers catch 80% of the fish is actually pretty accurate.