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crappieseeker
12-05-2012, 04:54 AM
I am lucky to have a few gas stations in my area that offer no ethanol gas. Some people say it is still a good idea to use stabil in the tank. I went to walmart and found some but they have two different kinds. They had a reddish color one that just said stabil and a blue color one that said marine stabil. The info on the back was the same, the price on the front was twice as much for the marine product. Is the regular stabil fine to use or should I use the marine. I think they are the same and just a marketing ploy.

wannabe fisherman
12-05-2012, 06:11 AM
I've been using red for years now and no problems yet

yankee doodler
12-05-2012, 07:06 AM
Just some additional info for what it's worth off another site:


Thanks for the input. According to the Stabil folks the only difference between the two products is that Marinbe Stabil just has more of the same stuff in it. The following quotes their web site:

"How does MARINE Formula STA-BIL® Ethanol Treatment and Performance Improver work, and how is it different from Regular STA-BIL?
MARINE Formula STA-BIL Ethanol Treatment is a new, enhanced formula of STA-BIL, America's top selling fuel stabilizer, that was designed to fight many of the unique problems related to ethanol in gasoline in the moisture-laden marine environment, and fights those problems in three ways:

1. Fights Fuel System Deposits – Ethanol in gasoline acts as a solvent on the accumulated deposits in marine fuel tanks, fuel lines, carburetors, injectors. These loosened deposits can cause engine performance problems, including hard starting, rough running and stalling. MARINE Formula STA-BIL cleans-up power-robbing deposits from carburetors, fuel injectors and intake valves to improve engine performance. MARINE Formula STA-BIL contains more than FOUR TIMES the fuel system cleaner in Regular STA-BIL – it is a Complete Fuel System Cleaner.

2. Fights Fuel System Corrosion – Ethanol in gasoline attracts water from the moist marine air. Since virtually all marine fuel systems manufactured through 2007 vent to the air, the ethanol continually attracts water – which can cause corrosion damage to marine fuel tanks, fuel lines, carburetors and injectors. MARINE Formula STA-BIL contains DOUBLE the corrosion preventer in Regular STA-BIL, to fight the unique problems of ethanol in gasoline in the marine environment, including marine fuel tanks which vent to the marine air.

3. Fights Fuel Degradation – Pumped gasoline starts to degrade immediately. MARINE Formula STA-BIL keeps fuel fresh for up to 12 months in marine gas tanks. Just like Regular STA-BIL, adding MARINE Formula STA-BIL Keeps Fuel Fresh , and eliminates the need to drain fuel prior to storage."

From the companies description it seems they are basically the same although Marine Stabil has higher formulation for corrosion prevention and fuel system cleaning.

Rees Guide
12-05-2012, 07:53 AM
If you are running your boat fairly regular, couple times a month, then there is no need to add it. Keeping a boat covered or in a shed will help more than anything, a boat that sits in direct sunlite has way more probs than one that is protected from the elements. My boat gets run real regular so I dont fool with it.

olduckhunter
12-05-2012, 08:00 AM
yes, use the blue stabil. you never know for sure that the gas is ethanol free. an one ounce is not gonna cost that much each fill up and may save you lots of money down the road.

Don G
12-05-2012, 08:20 AM
Let me first say"I don't know if this is true or not".

I don't think there is a product out there that will separate water from ethanol gas. A petroleum engineer said that you have to heat ethanol gas to 160 degrees to separate the water. If that is the case, what good would any "treatment" do?

fished-out
12-05-2012, 12:32 PM
I use ethanol gas; also add startron periodically to combat any separation. No problems.

crappieseeker
12-05-2012, 02:02 PM
i use the boat about 3 times a week and it is stored under a carport

Tracker123
12-05-2012, 02:24 PM
Let me first say"I don't know if this is true or not".

I don't think there is a product out there that will separate water from ethanol gas. A petroleum engineer said that you have to heat ethanol gas to 160 degrees to separate the water. If that is the case, what good would any "treatment" do?

The ethanol/water mixture commonly found in gasolines is an azeotrope - which can not be distilled at any temperature. As bizzare as it sounds, lime (calcium oxide) can be added which will form with the water to make calcium hydroxide in which both can be filtered out. Jet fuel manufacturers utilize salt in a simular manner. But all this seems extreme.

What the common off the shelf products do is "break up" the water into smaller particles (easily emulsified) so it may pass through the system along with the fuel.

Ranger690
12-05-2012, 02:52 PM
I hate spending the money on it too, but it does do something to help make the gas last longer. If you need to see it, get you two glass jars and put in fresh gas. Squirt a bit of Stabil in one. Leave the other alone. Cap them and put them away. Go check them 30 days, and again in 60. My boat will set sometimes for months. I use it. Gas still looks and smells like gas.

You can test your gas to see how much ethanol is in it. You need a container (preferably a graduated cylinder). Add some water to the container and mark the water line. Fill with gas. Shake or stir. Look how you new "water line" has moved up. The Ethanol and water mixed and will fall out of solution. I did it at my local gas station as a test to see if it was more than 10%. It was right at 10%. Google it for a video example.

My water seperator filter does get some water in it from time to time. It is worth paying attention too.

Dayton

crappieseeker
12-05-2012, 03:14 PM
i meant to put 3 times a month

justinp61
12-05-2012, 03:37 PM
I run the marine Stabile in mine al the time, my boat sits just about all summer and sometimes a couple weeks at a time in the fall and winter, it also has a water seperator on it. I don't know if the Stabil helps with water but it will help keep the gas fresh.

Don G
12-05-2012, 03:50 PM
The ethanol/water mixture commonly found in gasolines is an azeotrope - which can not be distilled at any temperature. As bizzare as it sounds, lime (calcium oxide) can be added which will form with the water to make calcium hydroxide in which both can be filtered out. Jet fuel manufacturers utilize salt in a simular manner. But all this seems extreme.

What the common off the shelf products do is "break up" the water into smaller particles (easily emulsified) so it may pass through the system along with the fuel.

Tracker123, thanks for your explanation. If I use Startron(my choice over Stabil) should I have any water in the water separator or does all the water pass through the engine?

Do you have a choice of which product to use?

Thanks again for your input.

C_McKinney
12-05-2012, 04:25 PM
I use sea-foam in my boat and other gas engines. I try to use real gas but all my stations carry the 10% ethanol. I have to drive 20 miles to Oklahoma to buy real gas. Before I used sea-foam I used the Blue Stabil. No problems with either.

HalAC
12-05-2012, 11:01 PM
I would avoid using Sea-Foam since it contains the following ingedients: Pale Oil, Naphtha, "IPA" Isopropyl Alcohol.

olduckhunter
12-06-2012, 05:45 AM
seafoam is some good stuff. i've used it in all my outboard motors for a long time. at the beginning of the year if my motors have set up for some time i'll start off the first tank of gas with a full can of seafoam and double the amount of marine stabil. keeps them running good.

yankee doodler
12-06-2012, 07:11 AM
Here's a link to a post made back in '10 on the subject:

http://www.crappie.com/crappie/main-crappie-fishing-forum/82339-ethanol-issue-another-thread-but-must-read.html

HalAC
12-06-2012, 06:15 PM
The isopropyl alcohol will draw moisture and cancel out the effects of the Sta-Bil. Alcohol of any sort is detrimental to any small engine.

Here is a list of fuel additives and what the contain.

Fuel Additives (http://www.fuel-testers.com/is_gas_additive_safe_with_e10_list.html)

PIGINTHEPIGPEN
12-06-2012, 08:01 PM
Boat kept in the garage. rarely sets over 30 days. Never used sta-bil in the 12 years I have owned my boat. Not one single problem with the Yamaha 4-stroke. Lucky I guess?

Crestliner08
12-06-2012, 08:11 PM
Well, I use StarTron in all my gas engines; outboards, lawnmowers & snowblower. Have never had to have a carb stripped & cleaned. They perform very reliably and have done so for many years now. On my boat I also use a 10 Micron (Yamaha is the only Mfgr. making one this fine) water separator between the fuel tank and the engine. I think I've taken about as good a set of precautions as is possible! And in these changing times, that's about all you can do I guess. :)

CrappiePappy
12-07-2012, 01:55 AM
On my boat I also use a 10 Micron (Yamaha is the only Mfgr. making one this fine) water separator between the fuel tank and the engine.

Don't think so, Crestliner .... I have a Moeller Clear View 10 micron water separator. Moeller, Sierra, and a few other mfg's make 10 micron filters (& 21 micron & 28 micron) for various boat motor brands. I don't think Yamaha actually "makes" any such product ... just "recommends" a 10 micron filter.

************************************

As to my experience with Stabil & SeaFoam .....

I ran my previous 70hp Yammy for close to 15yrs on E10 ... nothing added ... and it was still running strong when I sold it.
My current boat w/90 Merc was sold to me with a full tank of gas ... Stabil & Seafoam added by previous owner... and the tank of gas lasted me a full year. Last fill up, I added Marine Stabil (only) and have used it over the last year, down to < 1/4tank ... and it runs fine. My Moeller water separator will be installed before I start using the boat again, early next year. I will likely continue to use the Marine Stabil, since there may be periods of time when the boat may be idle for prolonged periods ... and I'll depend on the water separator to remove any condensation that may occur during that time frame, whether from the E10 alcohol or the Marine Stabil alcohol. There isn't any E0 gas available in my immediate area.

... cp :kewl

crappieseeker
12-07-2012, 04:47 AM
some make it sound like the stabil is useless and some say it is important. I guess with my gas being ethanol free and me running it regularly I should be ok without the stabil. I guess later on I might check into having a separator put on

Tracker123
12-07-2012, 07:04 AM
I always run ethanol free fuel. There is a sticky on the Louisiana board that lists all the stations in Louisiana and Mississippi. It's also kept up to date. That being said, I still use stabil. There still are issues down here with condensation and lower grade fuels. I know what the additives are in stabil and want them there in my fuel system regardless of the quality of fuel I buy. Just my two cents.

HalAC
12-07-2012, 01:29 PM
There is a web site that lists ethanol free gas state by state.

Pure Gas web site (http://pure-gas.org/)

Dutch552
12-07-2012, 11:06 PM
It's kind of a pain in the rear to keep up with ethanol free stations in my area. The only issues I have had that I can 100% attribute to the ethanol are the degredation of carborator parts-particularly the float. I have ran into the issue twice, both times with E10 UNTREATED fuel. SInce I have began to treat every single gallon of fuel that I put in my boat or other equipment I have not had to rebuild a carbdue to failure in more than two years. Every tank of boat gas gets treated with Startron and mix in Marine Stabil in the winter. I Seafoam twice per year for the carbon and to keep the rings nice and freed up but don't have evidence to support that it helps with the ethanol directly, but it is a very useful product nonetheless. I use red Stabil in all of my other equipment because there are times when a tank of gas sits in a machine for a few months without being used.

shipahoy41
12-08-2012, 07:04 AM
Confusious say "Better to close mouth and appear dumb...than to open big mouth and remove all doubt." I honestly do not know about stabil. I use red once a month in my boat and in the tractor. Works for me. I guess I do it because my dad did. No scientific reasoning here. This has been an enlightening thread.

NYHellbender
12-16-2012, 05:43 PM
I work at Advance Auto Parts, and I sell my customers Lucas Ethanol Treatment (Treats 80 gallons for about $10). I use it in my daily driver, as well as all of my small engines. Our local marinas and lawn contractors buy it buy the case. If you can't find Lucas Ethanol Treatment, the Marine Stabile is the next best thing. If you want a good Injector cleaner try K100. It works better than Sea-foam and is a few dollars cheaper. Startron is a good product but treats only 25 gallons for a $10 bottle. Parts Plus has a display of the different brands set up in clear bottles with gas. You can see the way each one works and which one do not. I have been using Lucas Ethanol Treatment for over a year now and use it in every fill up. My Jeep loves it. I get 2 weeks out of a tank full. If I skip the Lucas, I only get a week and 2-3 days out of the tank full. I hope this helps.

crappiehunterDave
12-16-2012, 06:24 PM
As advised by the mechanic at our closest boat shop I have been useing Sea Foam. I have been happy with it so far but may try some Lucas. I use lucas in my truck and like it

Tracker123
12-16-2012, 06:41 PM
Like I said previously, I know what is in the product of Stabil. Much like I know what is in the higher price Shell "V-Power" or Chevron "Techron", etc. It's good stuff. My two cents.

skiptomylu
12-16-2012, 06:53 PM
I use to buy Stabil, but a few yyears ago I started using Star Tron too and have not had any problems at all. My boat was stranded in it's slings for 1 1/2 years and when I got water under it there was no problem cranking it and it says it will last 2 years. Here is the link....

Star Tron Enzyme Fuel Treatment - HOME (http://mystarbrite.com/startron/)

MeanV2
12-16-2012, 07:02 PM
It always surprises me when someone says they run the cheapest gas & oil they can find in their $6000 or more outboard motor!
Is that what's called swallowing a camel and gaggin on a nat? ;)

Dan

C_McKinney
12-19-2012, 09:00 PM
Any way we could see some pictures of the display at parts plus?