Likes Likes:  0
Thanks Thanks:  0
HaHa HaHa:  0
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 11

Thread: Fish Swim Bladders

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    1,963
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Fish Swim Bladders


    A while back I was trying to discuss how a fish's swim bladder was attached to the fish's stomach. I could not get a picture on the old forum but I was able to finally get this picture and hopefully it will post on this new forum.

    This is also a test.

    Note: The picture's memory requirements can be seen by right clicking on the picture and then left clicking on the properties item in the drop down list.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Regards,

    Moose1am

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    in a VAN down by the RIVER, Georgia/Alabama line
    Posts
    5,355
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    These bladders are interesting. They hold air awhile after they die. Ever cleaned a fish and busted the air bladder.

    Do they release and take in air to stay at certain depths? If they breathe with gills, why does it attach to the digestive tract?

    thanks.
    smitty

    "If people concentrated on the really important things in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles." ~Doug Larson

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    1,963
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Air can be released into a fish's air bladder though the capilaries that line the inside of the fish's air bladder. It's a slow process. Just like our lungs can release Carbon Monoxide, the fish's air bladder can exchange gases with the capilaries inside the swim bladder or air bladder. But we are more effecient at this since the surface area of our lungs is equal to the size of a NFL foot ball field. Our lungs are full of tiny aveoli that give us the large surface area. Fish's air bladders are smooth and they don't have a lot of surface area. Therefore the exchange of air from the capilaries to the air bladder is much slower. This is what the Ichythyology book said in summary. It goes into a lot more detail on how these things work but that is the gist of it.

    Not all fish have the same setup inside them. I did read that some minnows for example have not air bladder at all. So not all fish have an air badder. Some fish today breath air still. I know that cat fish gulp air and can live for a long time out of water as compared to a bass for example. Lung fish can breath air though thier air bladders and walk around on mud flats. Mud skippers in India can survive out of the water for long periods of time.

    Most fish breath though the gills. The oxygen is dissolved in the water and the gills can extract the oxygen out of the water and I suppose give off carbon dioxide to the water from the gills. That is the main way that fish get their oxygen today. Maybe the very early fish (Geologically speaking) needed air bladders to help them breath. I don't really know.

    Why the air bladder is still attached to the stomach of some fish today I have no idea. LOL Good question though. Wish I could ask my old college professor this question as I have wondered about that myself.


    Do they release and take in air to stay at certain depths? If they breathe with gills, why does it attach to the digestive tract?

    thanks.
    smitty[/QUOTE]
    Regards,

    Moose1am

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    in a VAN down by the RIVER, Georgia/Alabama line
    Posts
    5,355
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Do the fish use the swim bladder to stay at certain depths?
    thanks for the info. Is this why barometric pressure affects them easily?

    "If people concentrated on the really important things in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles." ~Doug Larson

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    1,963
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    yes to first question

    Most likely answer to second question. Although many other things can effect the fishs behaviour when the air pressure changes. Normally when we get a cold front coming though the clouds increase that day and decrease after the front passes. The air cools as the Cold Front approaches and that cools the shallow waters and this effects the fish too. And after the front passes the water is lite up by bright sunshine especially when there are no clouds in the sky. Lots of UV radiation UV A UVB will be hitting the water's surface. And UV rays can penetrate deeper into the water than long color waves of light such as reds.

    I know that fish will hide from the light and stay closer to structure and in the shade or under a horizontal log. By going under the log they are shaded from the sun but I see no way that the log could protect them from an increase or a decrease in air or water pressure.

    Just as the increased air pressure pushing down on the mercury's surface pushs the mercury up inside the sealed glass tube the same air pressure can push on the lakes surface and increase the water pressure in the water column. The pressure at 33 ft is about two Atmospheres. If you double the air pressure above you you would be at 2 Atmospheres.

    You have 1 atmosphere of air pressure above you and 1 atmosphere of water pressure above you when you are at 33ft below the surface. The air pressure above you adds to the water's pressure. They combine to increase the pressure on you when you are at 33ft deep.

    The fish can sense the increased water pressure around them I would think with their lateral lines. If they can detect a minnow swimming in the water and zero in on that minnow using the pressure waves that the minnow gives off as it swims then surely they can detect small increases in the water pressure around them. Whether the air pressure alone or the combiation of increasing air pressure and increased sunlight and colder water after the front passes by effects the fish is still unanswered.


    Quote Originally Posted by FalconSmitty
    Do the fish use the swim bladder to stay at certain depths?
    thanks for the info. Is this why barometric pressure affects them easily?
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by Moose1am; 01-24-2005 at 02:01 AM.
    Regards,

    Moose1am

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Danbury, NC
    Posts
    5,175
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Saw an apisode of Roland Martin,s Show a couple of weeks ago and he was catching Red Snapper over 200' deep and the bladders were poking out of their mouths where they came up to quick and he just took a knife an puntures the bladder and released the fish - he said the fish would be fine and they did swim off - I don't knoe if the bladder would work again or not
    with my mind on crappie and crappie on my mind -
    and if ya'll see Goober later tellem I said duh huh - he'll know what ya mean!!!!!!!!

  7. #7
    soundpainter Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose1am
    Air can be released into a fish's air bladder though the capilaries that line the inside of the fish's air bladder. It's a slow process. Just like our lungs can release Carbon Monoxide, the fish's air bladder can exchange gases with the capilaries inside the swim bladder or air bladder. But we are more effecient at this since the surface area of our lungs is equal to the size of a NFL foot ball field. Our lungs are full of tiny aveoli that give us the large surface area. Fish's air bladders are smooth and they don't have a lot of surface area. Therefore the exchange of air from the capilaries to the air bladder is much slower. This is what the Ichythyology book said in summary. It goes into a lot more detail on how these things work but that is the gist of it.

    Not all fish have the same setup inside them. I did read that some minnows for example have not air bladder at all. So not all fish have an air badder. Some fish today breath air still. I know that cat fish gulp air and can live for a long time out of water as compared to a bass for example. Lung fish can breath air though thier air bladders and walk around on mud flats. Mud skippers in India can survive out of the water for long periods of time.

    Most fish breath though the gills. The oxygen is dissolved in the water and the gills can extract the oxygen out of the water and I suppose give off carbon dioxide to the water from the gills. That is the main way that fish get their oxygen today. Maybe the very early fish (Geologically speaking) needed air bladders to help them breath. I don't really know.

    Why the air bladder is still attached to the stomach of some fish today I have no idea. LOL Good question though. Wish I could ask my old college professor this question as I have wondered about that myself.


    Do they release and take in air to stay at certain depths? If they breathe with gills, why does it attach to the digestive tract?

    thanks.
    smitty
    [/QUOTE]

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Augusta, Arkansas
    Posts
    317
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    When we were growing up we were poor. We used fish air bladders for baloons.
    Let Em' Land!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Ohio - Home of Grant, Sherman & Sheridan
    Posts
    1,142
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    >>> I did read that some minnows for example have not air bladder at all<<<

    Moose, the darters and daces generally lack air bladders. When we do the electro-shock fish sampling with the MetroParks biologist in the local streams, one of our biggest jobs is scooping up these fish before they sink into the rocks. Chubs and "minnows" will float to the top, but the rainbow darters, black-nosed daces and related will sink like a rock. They normally use their pectoral fins to walk on the bottom in search of food. They are also good indicators of stream health.

    BTW, Roland Martin killed the fish, whether he wants to admit it or not. - Roberta
    "Anglers are born honest,
    but they get over it." - Ed Zern

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    52
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Sharks don't have air bladder, this gives them the ability to change depth quickly when hunting for food. On the other hand, they have to keep swimming all their life, otherwise they would sink to the bottom of the ocean.

    BTW, moose, the lungs release carbon dioxide, not monoxide.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

BACK TO TOP