Thanks Thanks:  0
HaHa HaHa:  0
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 24

Thread: Deep Cycle vs Starting Batteries

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    409
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default


    some people are adding a battery for electronics only. My humingbird Helix 7 and livewell will kill my crank battery

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Benton, KY
    Posts
    660
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    You should be good with a size 29 deep cycle or even a 31, they are VERY close in size, most manufactures don't even make the size 29 anymore and just jump up to 31 (like Interstate)

    Deka/Duracell recommendation chart based on outboard size: http://www.dekabatteries.com/assets/...ionslayout.pdf
    Deka/Duracell battery specs chart: http://www.eastpennmanufacturing.com...Sheet-0194.pdf


    Based on that chart for a 60 hp, you need a minimum of 380 CCA (502 MCA)

    Interstate 24 cranking battery that you had, assuming it's a 24M-XHD
    CCA - 800
    MCA - 1000
    RC min at 25 amp draw - 135 min

    In going to a deep cycle, you lose some of the cranking amps in exchange for more reserve capacity, which is what you seem to be needing more of.

    If you stick with Interstate, just going up to a
    SRM-27 you get
    CCA - 600
    MCA - 750
    RC min at 25 amp draw - 160 min

    Or if you had the room (the 29 and 31 are so close in size, wouldn't hurt to double-check the dimensions),
    SRM-31
    CCA - 675
    MCA - 845
    RC min at 25 amp draw - 210 min


    I think the best value right now is the Duracell Group 31 Model# 31DC at Sam's Club for $100. It's the exact same battery as the Deka DC31DT
    CCA - 650
    MCA - 800
    RC min at 25 amp draw - 185 min

  3. #13
    "G"'s Avatar
    "G" is offline Super Duper Moderator - 2012 Crappie.Com Man of the year & 2018 Crappie.com Decade of Exceptional Service Awards * Crappie.com Supporter * Member Sponsor
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Belden, MS
    Posts
    95,225
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by deltarat View Post
    The tac is working as well as the volt meter. My battery only runs down when I use the livewell. The days I am not keeping any fish, I have no problems. I was must wanting to know if I went from a 24 cranking battery to a 29 deep cycle would be OK to use.
    Yes a 29 will be fine

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Crappie.com Fishing mobile app
    I have spent most my life fishing........the rest I wasted.
    PROUD MEMBER OF TEAM GEEZER
    PICO Lures Field Rep

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    SW Indiana
    Posts
    2,734
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullet101 View Post
    Using a deep cycle battery can interfere with your charging system and the starting system. Deep cycle batteries have thin lead plates that are meant to put out a very low
    amperage over a long period of time like troling motors do. When you use one to start your motor, it pulls way too much amperage and creates heat in your starter, battery and in the wiring harness that will eventually lead to premature failure in one or all. Also a motor, like yours, with a stator and rectifier charging system are not meant to charge deep cycle batteries. The rectifier is a series of diodes (one way check valve for electricity) and resistors. The rectifier usually lets the battery over charge and causes its self to overheat and short to ground. I have a motor just like yours in my shop right now. I can text pictures if you would like to see what happens when a deep cycle is used for cranking. I recommend fixing the battery drain and switching to an Interstate 24M-XHD before you wind up spending a lot of money in repairs.
    Exactly the opposite. Deep-cycle batteries have thicker plates while cranking batteries have more plates but thinner ones. Plate surface area is what controls maximum output and charging current, so deep-cycle batteries charge a little slower with a little less current going in than cranking batteries.

    The starter will pull exactly the same current from a battery no matter what kind of battery you have hooked up. Only the construction of the starter and the mechanical load of turning the outboard can change the current draw of the starter.

    The heating of the charging system components in a stator based system is a function of the electrical usage between charges, not the battery technology. Modern boats with electronics and other equipment just use a lot of power and these charging systems aren't designed for the job. If you draw 5 amps for 2 hours from a battery, the load on the charging system to recharge the battery is going to be about the same and so is the heat. The charging system will be maxed out trying to recharge the battery whether it is a deep-cycle or a cranking battery.

    Very few outboards with starter motors are rectifier only systems. Some very old ones still are, but most use combination rectifier/regulators to limit maximum charging voltage.

    Outboard manufacturers misunderstand the issue and issue recommendations that don't really help. On a regulated system, Mercury still recommends against AGMs even though the AGM is substantially faster at charging which would reduce the overall power (and therefore heat) needed to be provided by the charging system because AGMs waste much less of the charging energy. An AGM is built like a starting battery with thin plates, but the starved electrolyte construction with the mats between the plates protects them from the deterioration deep-cycling would normally cause on the thin plates.
    Likes Central Minn, Dutch552 LIKED above post

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Location
    Seymour,TN
    Posts
    24
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Cut two different batteries open and you will see that I am right. I am not talking about rectifier only systems either. The motor he is asking about has a 16 amp charging system and running a deep cycle or AGM battery will kill the reg/rectifier and or the stator. No. The starter will not draw more amperage from a deep cycle battery. It will draw more amperage than a deep cycle battery is meant to put out. Like I said in my first post, send me your number and I will text pictures of what can happen when you run a deep cycle battery in place of a cranking battery.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    SW Indiana
    Posts
    2,734
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullet101 View Post
    Cut two different batteries open and you will see that I am right. I am not talking about rectifier only systems either. The motor he is asking about has a 16 amp charging system and running a deep cycle or AGM battery will kill the reg/rectifier and or the stator. No. The starter will not draw more amperage from a deep cycle battery. It will draw more amperage than a deep cycle battery is meant to put out. Like I said in my first post, send me your number and I will text pictures of what can happen when you run a deep cycle battery in place of a cranking battery.
    I've been an electrical engineer for 35 years with a significant time in batteries and charging. Nothing you are saying is correct.

    Deep-cycle batteries have thick plates. Cranking batteries have thin plates. You fundamentally misunderstand how batteries work and are built. A deep-cycle battery will have no issues working as a cranking battery if it has enough cranking current capacity to do so. With a small outboard they are excellent choices for cranking batteries.

    To learn about battery construction, check out this article by Crown Batteries Cranking Battery vs. Deep Cycle Marine Battery A couple of quotes from the article:

    The more plate surface area exists in the battery, the easier it is for that battery to provide the necessary power. That is exactly why cranking batteries have many thin plates, to increase surface area
    and

    A deep cycle marine battery, or trolling battery, consists of fewer plates, but those plates are thicker......Deep cycle marine batteries are also much less likely to overheat since their thicker plate construction can withstand high temperatures during heavy currents.
    Again, the current drawn from the charging system is determined by the amount of power that was drawn out of the battery since the last charge. It doesn't matter whether the battery is a deep-cycle or a cranking battery or an AGM, the charging system will be putting every amp it has into the battery trying to charge it if there has been a lot of use since then. The AGM advantage is that it accepts charge current much more efficiently so it requires less charging system run time.

    Indeed, these systems are very prone to overheating in modern fishing boats, but the reason isn't the type of battery, it's the amount of power being used by the boat to run electronics and other equipment. You are virtually forced to use a deep-cycle battery in order to have enough power left to crank the outboard. All you can do it make sure to charge the battery fully between trips, keep an eye on the rectifier/regulator for signs of overheating on the wires and use only OEM replacement regulator/rectifiers when replacing them.
    Likes Dutch552, sliderman LIKED above post

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Location
    Seymour,TN
    Posts
    24
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Stick to it because you would starve as an outboard tecnician. I've been a certified Mercury, OMC, Bombardier and Yamaha tecnician for 23 years. I'm not stating opinions. You can call Mercury and argue the importance of cranking batteries to them. Or maybe you know more about it than them!!!

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    SW Indiana
    Posts
    2,734
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullet101 View Post
    Stick to it because you would starve as an outboard tecnician. I've been a certified Mercury, OMC, Bombardier and Yamaha tecnician for 23 years. I'm not stating opinions. You can call Mercury and argue the importance of cranking batteries to them. Or maybe you know more about it than them!!!
    I would imagine I do know a lot more about it than them. Some of my batteries were on boats that cost $3 billion each.
    Likes strmwalker LIKED above post

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    va
    Posts
    186
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I am not an engineer or a certified boat mechanic nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night but having spent ample time and many years chasing down information to try to choose the correct batteries for my applications my understanding is that the design of a STARTING battery uses more thinner plates which design allows the battery to put out a higher amperage for short time periods which fits in with the typical current and amp draw as the battery would see during the starting of a larger size marine engine.

    On the other hand a DEEP CYCLE battery has fewer but thicker lead plates that although the peak amperage output is lower than a starting battery these plates can put out lower amp loads for much longer time frames without the batteries plates overheating or warping hence better for trolling motor or any lower amp load that last more than a short duration.

    Today's modern higher HP outboards are very picky in having a starting battery capable of meeting minimum amperage demand specifications when being started.

    Also the increase in the amount of electronics and the amount of amps they draw in many cases are requiring dedicated batteries to meet their demands and in those cases a deep cycle is the correct choice.

    My opinion for starting anything over about 25-30 hp in a modern engine use a starting battery and any other use use a deep cycle battery. DUAL PURPOSE batteries is nothing but a marketing ploy and at best gives you a battery that is not really designed to do any job as well as a battery designed for the job at hand.

    This is my understanding of battery differences and personally I still use the old wet cell technology as it is the most cost effective in my opinion. It does not bother me to pay about half the dollars for a battery that every few months I need to take the caps off and check the water levels. But my batteries are easy to access.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    East Peoria IL.
    Posts
    4,898
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    How old is the battery?

    Sent from my XT1710-02 using Crappie.com Fishing mobile app
    HOI Crappie Club
    Where family and friends come to compete for a little more than bragging rights.

    Quick, someone teach me how to fish so I can win this tournament!!!

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

BACK TO TOP